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The Pros and Cons of Japanese Cars

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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-26 22:00 | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
转载文学城的文章6 l& X2 @0 A$ \3 `3 u2 U

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, `9 s6 B- |* m' R# E) g7 H7 AIntroduction
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( W2 b. l% I) rThe recent Toyota, Honda and Ford recall episodes served as a catalyst to share the obviously minority opinions based on the personal experience helping friends reviewing, selecting, purchasing and repairing numerous vehicles of various models from an 1.3 Liter Toyota Tercel to a 4.4 Liter BMW 5 Series during the past 20 years in the States.8 J: i  l+ f' K8 ^9 t

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The interior ergonomics fits the stature of average Asians. Consequently everything inside is conveniently reachable and outside objects are easily visible.
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It saves gas. This is particularly true before mid 2000’s when domestic cars improved their gas mileage. Nevertheless the gas saved has a cost which is either on performance, or on safety, sometimes both.
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5 j7 G; W5 @: pHigher resale value. If you count the inflated initial purchase price over comparable domestic models, however, you get about even, not to count the lost of interest which may be enough to cover the difference in gas consumption.9 D* Z5 F$ `% K

$ L2 C3 I: V7 ?6 hLonger service life over domestic models. Very true between early 1980's and mid-1990's. The difference started to shrink in 1993 when Ford started to catch up on quality followed by GM in late 1990’s. Currently the deviation within a manufacturer, domestic or foreign, is larger than the average difference between brands.
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7 u/ a* L, q6 @4 d/ wReliability. It has become a legend. The legend is formed like this. Initially as a struggling student bought a used domestic car between early 1980’s and mid 1990’s. That was the quality dark age of domestic auto industry. Tired of repair bills, followed the advices from Consumer Reports. Bought a new Japanese car between early 1990’s and early 2000’s. That was the peak quality period of the Japanese auto industry. Then reached the conclusion of superior reliability of Japanese cars. Apple to apple? No. This is a comparison between a fresh apple and a rotten orange.9 H( m- N' h8 l( v- U( b

5 r# [) }( L( a: d) [6 P6 ABetter interior design and material. Making good seats are way easier than producing good engines or transmissions. When a neat interior is used to accompany a nice drive system, this is called luxury. When employed to deceive the driver from an under-designed machine under the hood, it’s another story. Average buyers spend far more time checking the passenger cabin than looking under the hood when evaluating a vehicle. It’s like buying a book by only checking the color of the cover. The car makers take advantage of this evaluation process.
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Image of a successful person’s vehicle. This is true for those without the historical knowledge that Japanese cars entered the US market as low-end vehicles. Even 20 years ago, the images of Toyota and Honda were about the same as what Hyundai enjoys today. Although efforts were made in the following years to create luxury divisions and brands like Lexus, Acura and Infinity, and to distant the luxury brands from the budget manufactures that produce them, it is hard to erase history, not to mention many shared parts underneath the sheet metal.
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A low risk purchase as everyone you know buys it. Following the crowd is generally safer than venturing alone, except when the subject is complex, and there is misleading marketing influence. Now the music has stoped. Each of those 9 million owners of recalled cars could have to face hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars of potential loss of resale values of their vehicles due to the negative publicity in the media. The risk can’t be higher.1 U$ V7 I; P; X, z
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" j: K: n1 T# p0 o; fWeak engine. That is a convenient way to reduce manufacturing cost and to improve gas mileage. Reduced engine noise coupled with the super light over-assisted gas pedal (the key to the recent recall) deprive the feedback a driver needs to receive, hence give the driver a false impression of an engine with enough power. Check the tachometer, you will be surprised.. j3 c$ p3 ]$ w- j( T0 H; L# k
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Weak structural integrity due to the ultimate goal of reducing vehicle weight. This is typically not visible until an accident happens or a repair is needed. Classical examples can be found in the auto recycling centers a.k.a. junk yards where some post-accident vehicles are available for post-mortem review.1 U1 A$ G# @5 q) w4 M6 b# H

8 G, K" _0 c& ~9 o" X  N0 P; w) uAlmost every component is trimmed to the bare bone without much spare for possible contingency. It does save weight, hence gas, but when a little extra is needed to either sustain a bit heavy duty task, or to protect you from an accident, sorry, it is not there. Just-in-Time delivery of parts is a revolutionary contribution to the manufacturing world, but just-barely-enough design is merely better than cutting corners.. K$ ?; ]9 ]! ^  y9 C

* T- O5 u( ^# M! K" ?" k2 jGross weight is usually lighter than comparable domestic, due to the same goal of reducing weight. A big disadvantage in safety. Crumple zones help deliver good results in collision tests. But in real life, a heavy vehicle with a crumple zone is far safer than a light one with a crumple zone. Laws of physics say the deceleration, hence the injury to the passengers, is reversely proportional to the weights of the two colliding vehicles. See further discussion of collision safety in the following link.% x0 D; f- N+ `: T
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Overpriced than comparable domestic thanks to the perceived reputation. Rarely a discount is offered. Even in a tough economical situation, the incentive is typically $2000 – $5000 less than what a comparable domestic model offers.
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The manufactures target those who either don't like car maintenance or don't know cars, and produce products with a superior passenger cabin but employ lower standards outside of the cabin. Disk brakes, Alloy Wheels, and Brake Override Systems have been standard on most mid-size domestic cars for years, yet are still optional or non-existent on many major Japanese mid-size cars being sold today.' r1 ~  r/ b5 e6 j

5 E$ j; U$ `0 A7 {+ q" IGroup Image. In January CNN reports a typical buyer of these cars is someone who is willing to pay $5000 extra for something that has no good performance, no attractive or exciting looks, not fun to drive, less safe than its peers, but was said to be reliable several years ago.  O( N' y7 K7 F' X+ m/ R
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Wrong bet on gas mileage. With the current global economical conditions, the awareness and publicity of global warming issues, the revisit of nuclear power plants, and thanks to the millions of hybrids on the road, the demand for oil has been and will be lowered. Another era of low oil price could occur in the foreseeable future when the speculators abandon the commodity market and shift to the next booming market.
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Useful Links:# u$ W5 _$ w9 X4 c

, f$ P- H' m5 eAbout Car Collision
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9 H& }6 p; t7 h- w# d2 |( _8 Phttp://www.yump.net.cn/Article/HTML/Article_2439.shtml
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1 e# y; f8 B' e" W2 TAbout Car Repair
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http://web.wenxuecity.com/BBSVie ... best&MsgID=1077
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6 K: Z5 K( g0 y# t% U7 }3 yAbout Toyota; ]8 {8 o) T4 p; D7 a3 t3 ]# ]% T
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http://news.wenxuecity.com/messa ... gb2312-1018929.html
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-26 22:03 | 显示全部楼层
本来是想翻译一下的,后来一想,费那么大劲儿, 老杨也给不了几个工钱,还不如让大家练练英语。
鲜花(48) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-26 22:44 | 显示全部楼层
a typical buyer of these cars is someone who is willing to pay $5000 extra for something that has no good performance, no attractive or exciting looks, not fun to drive, less safe than its peers, but was said to be reliable several years ago.7 c" j9 ?; x/ s1 _# G4 \6 y! m" U
鲜花(48) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-26 22:46 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队 追求完美
Reliability. It has become a legend. The legend is formed like this. Initially as a struggling student bought a used domestic car between early 1980’s and mid 1990’s. That was the quality dark age of domestic auto industry. Tired of repair bills, followed the advices from Consumer Reports. Bought a new Japanese car between early 1990’s and early 2000’s. That was the peak quality period of the Japanese auto industry. Then reached the conclusion of superior reliability of Japanese cars. Apple to apple? No. This is a comparison between a fresh apple and a rotten orange.
鲜花(12) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-26 23:46 | 显示全部楼层
膜拜一下,太他妈的经典了。
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:36 | 显示全部楼层
从顶级豪华 SUV 全速猛撞警车结果,看实战中保险杠的作为(组图)3 p% l4 h. x$ T6 C

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7 Q: |  H. ]' `! g7 W  n; v% O一个幸福美满的亚裔移民六口之家,在大女儿结婚之前,半夜三更去赶一年一度的感恩节后的黑色星期五。在清晨返家的高速路上,48岁父亲驾驶的 Lexus LX 470 SUV 全速撞上一辆停在路肩上的 Ford Crown Victoria 警车。 # Y6 i4 g+ p1 \0 L! }5 w; D
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Lexus里坐中后排的四个女儿中的两个在撞车后被甩出车外,其中24岁的大女儿当场殒命,另一个几小时后也不治身亡。车内的父母和另外两个女儿也受伤,有的伤势严重。
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坐在警车里的警察仅脸部受轻伤,并无大碍。 6 _( l2 R( F2 u

: I. Q) n. W: Q2 A9 y悲痛惋惜之余,人们不禁会问,为什么一辆口碑极佳的日本原装,5400 lb V8 顶级豪华越野车,与一辆没人看得上的 4100 lb 的 Sedan 相撞之后,结果会如此不同?
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4 c; i) q8 E. c$ R0 O看下面的事故回放。
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:42 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
刚撞完,注意 SUV 浑身是伤,但车尾右侧完好无损4 q/ z# `+ W) C) B% l. S
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2mnisrp.jpg
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:45 | 显示全部楼层
司机的左前门和B柱完好无损,说明 SUV 以右前角,和左后角作支点,撞击后在地上大角度打过滚。SUV 司机一侧的人受轻伤,另一侧重伤。注意右前轮不见了,掉在地上红色和白色购物袋之间的是前保险杠的漂亮塑料壳的左半边,右半边留在了警车的后门上 (见下图)。 这个壳只能受极小的力,过了 2.5 MPH,一碰就掉了。真正受力的,是还留在车上的黑色保险杠.
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:47 | 显示全部楼层
从警车被撞的损害看,是 SUV 以右前角,擦撞警车的左后角,警车的后轮没有脱落,SUV 的右半个保险杠壳撞击后,留在了警车的后门上.
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:49 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
警车的B柱没有变形,所以前门可以打开) T1 L# k$ M- I
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大型搬家
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:52 | 显示全部楼层
SUV 的右前轮一经擦撞就脱落了
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鲜花(242) 鸡蛋(8)
发表于 2012-12-27 00:53 | 显示全部楼层
scuba1995 发表于 2012-12-26 23:44 % u8 j- e( c7 D; A
a typical buyer of these cars is someone who is willing to pay $5000 extra for something that has no ...
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:56 | 显示全部楼层
同言同羽 置业良晨
高速下,少了右前轮,就像桌子少了一条腿,更容易翻车。这是向右翻滚的路径/ r+ _. F" d/ d! L, r( Y
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eqwo3p.jpg
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:58 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
这条前保险杠,Bumper Reinforce Bar,只保护中间,两边薄弱很多。右侧已经弯曲变形了,没能保护好右前轮0 ?8 Q" L2 x* E  l' T* c8 P

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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 00:59 | 显示全部楼层
Lexus LX 470 和 丰田 Land Cruiser 合用的前保险杠,注意两边的缩小尺寸空心省料设计。不知是不是吸能的设计。前轮一旦没有了足够保护,一旦遇上撞击,就只能直接把自己当保险杠用了。用完后就壮烈捐躯了,容易引起或加剧翻车事故
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 01:00 | 显示全部楼层
林肯 Navigator 前保险杠的设计
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 01:01 | 显示全部楼层
同言同羽 置业良晨
卡迪拉克 Escalade 前保险杠的设计8 h4 a7 l$ [" k1 k
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 01:02 | 显示全部楼层
Volvo 众多小车前保险杠的设计) @4 j7 H* u- _( M
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鲜花(242) 鸡蛋(8)
发表于 2012-12-27 01:03 | 显示全部楼层
别说,老美的一亩帕拉,陶若斯,malibu, fusion之类的车一开上就觉得特踏实,跟开佳美,雅阁感觉很不一样,呵呵
老柳教车
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 01:04 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
丰田 Sequoia 的前保险杠设计,注意前轮是没有一点保护的6 Q( H: J8 _+ {& D& C4 K
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鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 01:04 | 显示全部楼层
以上相片来自网络。记得不久之前,坛里讨论过厂商的被动安全设计,完全是根据政府的撞击试验的撞法,按考题准备考试的。在政府的正面撞墙,甚至 40% Offset 撞墙试验中,前轮有无保护不大影响试验结果。可是不保护前轮而省下的成本和改进的油耗,是厂商和顾客双双欢喜的东东,所以这个偷工减料,是周瑜打黄盖,一个愿打一个愿挨,做得完全合理合法。可怜的顾客,买车时是不会钻到车底下去检查安全措施的。
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! W2 Z5 L9 o( X今年夏天,IIHS 意识到了这样偷工减料可能带来的巨大危险,稍稍改了一下试验规则,即把 Offset 改成 25%,结果八成以上的豪华车名落孙山,最安全的车立刻变成了最不安全的车。道理很简单,原先的设计只能应付原先的考试,题目一改,就不及格了。 , ?& S$ j+ D( D/ B$ o% S2 ~& H
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记得下次撞车前,可要记得先去摸摸你的车的保险杠有多长,有多宽,再决定用哪一端去迎接挑战。
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IIHS 的 News Release 在这里。2 h; y8 o2 ?. }' B' a
http://www.iihs.org/news/rss/pr081412.html 4 s3 N1 x8 _$ t8 _/ R
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事故的具体报道在这里。
7 g: w% e, \& J' z. Khttp://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/pl ... o-crash-4063827.php
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鲜花(242) 鸡蛋(8)
发表于 2012-12-27 01:05 | 显示全部楼层
同言同羽 置业良晨
volvo,bumper开着就安逸啊
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 01:05 | 显示全部楼层
同言同羽 置业良晨
我下班了,洗洗睡了。
鲜花(128) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-27 09:30 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 亮甲店 于 2012-12-27 10:05 编辑
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" e/ z+ P* ?3 ~9 Y车板年度讨论又开始了。。。
4 ], u/ k: R, s3 u/ ]0 H这话题真的没啥意思议了/ U" R  T9 e8 w2 F. {
你要稍微爱点国。就别买日本新车了$ L  h1 v+ l, }$ L1 l' `
但是技术角度看,日车没你说的那么烂,也没那么神,可靠性的确好一点,美车喊了20几年 还是那个水平 最近2009年以后提高了点,7 L/ k- f+ Y' _
我只知道 最新的offset 测试。Acura TL 是仅有的2个达到good的luxury sedan 之一7 p( s" a$ V# e2 K. m+ l
什么美车 德车全挂。。不信自己youtube 9 e; e4 B' I+ c/ a- x+ q3 i4 A$ i
Having said that,那破车上个150就开始飘了。。奥迪200都没啥事。- b* ?' L: P- d: K9 j
总之 谁爱买什么车 是她的自由,这个lx撞警车片面了点。subaru是第二安全的车(japs)  美国有1百万闲钱的富豪里开得最多的是lexus 不无原因 crv 100万个事故只死了7个人,所以还是很多日车还是可以买的(技术层面)
鲜花(44) 鸡蛋(0)
 楼主| 发表于 2012-12-27 09:51 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
亮甲店 发表于 2012-12-27 09:30
, V$ d0 P! g" _% H( D车板年度讨论又开始了。。。+ C; S  J0 Y! y8 O' N$ i$ e2 S4 {
这话题真的没啥意思议了% z% B2 U( [( w$ Q, ^& F
你要稍微爱点国。就别买日本新车了
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打卡领工资,自娱自乐。我不买日本车,我也不在乎谁买什么车,我也不在乎别人怎么看我的帖子。
鲜花(11) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-27 11:05 | 显示全部楼层
支持技术讨论!
鲜花(7) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-27 12:55 | 显示全部楼层
好文
鲜花(7) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-27 12:57 | 显示全部楼层
我觉得大部分人买车过度关注油耗水平了。而且很多人没有去考虑这个车为什么省油。
鲜花(16) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2012-12-27 13:11 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
从来就没相信过吸能一说。。。。
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车重说明一切,如果细心的人会比较相同Size车的重量,日系车总是轻那么几百磅,原因是什么我想很多人没想过。。。
鲜花(7) 鸡蛋(1)
发表于 2012-12-27 22:39 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 headshot2008 于 2012-12-27 22:45 编辑   P& `! S- A7 v5 S) M: P5 J
SmartBrands 发表于 2012-12-27 13:11
  T& F* X+ C, P0 g, u从来就没相信过吸能一说。。。。
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9 U9 P4 Q# x. a, w  o车重说明一切,如果细心的人会比较相同Size车的重量,日系车总是轻那么 ...

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数据来自福特官网的“compare ford" powered by autodata5 ^/ U( i" x# r( x% R3 R$ F
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2013 Focus SE 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $20,349*                                           curb weight(kg)  1343
; y/ ?# u  O6 h7 f' w# g) F2013 Chevrolet Cruze LT Turbo 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $20,935*                    curb weight(kg)  1427- s. v7 |# r9 m' o- [& j. Z2 P" `
2013 Dodge Dart SXT/Rallye 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $19,690*                            curb weight(kg) 1445
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# q. N2 v# ?, A: y$ f/ L3 X2013 Honda Civic LX (M5) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $19,785*                            curb weight(kg)  1202* x; u0 j% i0 H0 B2 V4 P
2013 Toyota Corolla S (M5) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $22,170*                          curb weight(kg) 1250
( F* q3 u  k+ c, l8 D5 w2013 Mazda Mazda3 GS-SKY (M6) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $21,490*                  curb weight(kg) 1304" w$ A6 e4 q4 F+ G( V' D. Z7 O( Y/ d
2013 Mitsubishi Lancer SE 4dr Front-wheel Drive Sedan Total MSRP $20,648*    curb weight(kg) 1300' {$ }% m% B! Q' m
2013 Nissan Sentra 1.8 SV (CVT) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $20,515*                   curb weight(kg) 1295
+ p% C  N/ I2 b( J, ?8 D2013 Suzuki SX4 JX (CVT) 4dr Front-wheel Drive Hatchback Total MSRP $22,085*curb weight(kg) 1296( Q4 L! y' [4 W$ n/ \# T) [6 l
2013 Subaru Impreza 2.0i (M5) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $21,690*                       curb weight(kg) 1320. [# W+ `/ D: D# W+ ^( C7 ]* ]. p
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2013 Kia Forte 2.0L EX (M6) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $20,150*                         curb weight(kg) 1238
8 p! O2 f7 e1 Q! ^1 t7 ~2013 Hyundai Elantra GL (M6) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $19,844*                       curb weight(kg) 1207
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2013 Volkswagen Jetta 2.0L Comfortline (M5) 4dr Sedan Total MSRP $21,085* curb weight(kg) 1289
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